Cpnhelp.org

John- You are exactly correct: Cpni is an iron using organism, and iron starvation (sequestering by the macrophages) is actually one of the strategies our own body uses to limit supplies to bacteria. In fact, when I was first diagnosed I was very low in iron and required supplementation. But my iron levels didn't stabilize until about 6 months on the CAPi, which I assume was from the reduced depletion of iron by Cpn as well as less sequestering of iron by my immunei system. We may have some articles in the research section on all this.

I've similarly been concerned about the iron supplementation through Chlorella. I've never felt improved by taking it myself, and in fact felt worse after taking if for periods of time, but hard to know whether it was the chlorella or something else. Personally, unless you are actually low in iron from blood tests, I would avoid anything iron supplementing if possible. As David Wheldoni, a trained medical microbiologist, has recommended Chlorella perhaps these concerns about it's iron supplementation are not significant. But I would pay attention to your own responses, as it may make a difference if you have Cpn infection in more iron intensive organs such as bone marrow where iron-rich blood cells are produced, or the liver where iron is concentrated for making hemei.

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CAPi for Cpni 11/04. Dx: 25yrs CFSi & FMSi. Currently: 150mg BID Roxithromycin, Doxycycline 100mg BID, Tinii 1000mg/day pulses; Vit D2000 units, T4 & T3

Thanks Jim, it's good to know I'm not imagining things about iron and it's risks.  Hopefully, we can get more opinion on the subject from those who might be more familiar with how Cpni might benefit from increased iron availability.  Actually, I was hoping you would have some opinion from one of the doctors you've interviewed about that subject; however, that was only one possibility I was hoping would work out.  It would be good to hear from someone more in touch with the microcosm of iron consumption by Cpn and how taking an iron rich supplement like Chlorella might impact that.

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all my best

John

RRMSi/EDSSi was 4.5, 5, now 6 on Wheldon Protocol (naci, doxycycline, azithromycin, metronidazolei) since 04/12/2006. Added Rifampin 2x150mg/daily 08/19/2007. Added INHi 300mg/daily 03/17/2008 stopped 05/08

Just bumping this topic up as it might go unnoticed if it's not visible in the list of recent topics.

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all my best

John

RRMSi/EDSSi was 4.5, 5, now 6 on Wheldon Protocol (naci, doxycycline, azithromycin, metronidazolei) since 04/12/2006. Added Rifampin 2x150mg/daily 08/19/2007. Added INHi 300mg/daily 03/17/2008 stopped 05/08

Ok, so does anyone have an opinion on the subject?  Is this a case like Vitamin C and Flagyli where even if the C counters it or reduces its efficacy we need it so much anyway, regardless of whether it counters the effects of the drug?  Of course, in this case, we're not referring to any of the drugs but to the bug itself.  Any thoughts?

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all my best

John

RRMSi/EDSSi was 4.5, 5, now 6 on Wheldon Protocol (naci, doxycycline, azithromycin, metronidazolei) since 04/12/2006. Added Rifampin 2x150mg/daily 08/19/2007. Added INHi 300mg/daily 03/17/2008 stopped 05/08

John, You're just testing to see if any of us are reading the posts, aren't you?? 

 My take? I supplement with iron. This bug burns up iron and I was borderline anemic for years. I bruised like an overripe peach. Now I bruise normally. Now I'm not tired all the time.

Dr. Wheldon says we might want to supplement with iron. That's more than a recommendation for me. I'll reconsider my daily iron pill when I wean myself from the protocol.  It's been working fine for me, thus far. 

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The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world’s problems. Mohandas Gandhi

Hi Mac       

Thanks for the feedback.  It's good to hear from someone on this.  If DW says we might want to supplement with iron, then my take on it that it's probably not as negative as I thought it might be.  Of course, being a free radical isn't a good thing but we do need iron to make hemei and be healthy.  I just wonder about the consequences with a Cpni infection, if any.

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all my best

John

RRMSi/EDSSi was 4.5, 5, now 6 on Wheldon Protocol (naci, doxycycline, azithromycin, metronidazolei) since 04/12/2006. Added Rifampin 2x150mg/daily 08/19/2007. Added INHi 300mg/daily 03/17/2008 stopped 05/08

I know; I sometimes weigh 'this' against 'that', too, but the benefit of the iron seems to outweigh any concerns for me at this point. I ran out of my iron supps a few months ago and let it slide. Just forgot to order it, so it wasn't in the box of jars I sort into the giant ice cube tray each week. My body knew what my mind failed to notice, though. I started to fatigue a bit and I noticed bruises occurred a little more than my norm. When I began to supplement again, both the fatigue and the bruising went away within a few days, maybe a week.

I remember we discussed iron a lot the first few months on this site and I ended up taking Natural Factors Iron Chelate, 25 mg/daily, after culling through all the info. And, thanks for the reminder. Time to reorder. I'm down to my last five pills!

P.S. I'm tryng to find that discussion about iron, as I hate attributing anything to DW without a cite, though in this case it may have been via Sarah's conversation.  Perhaps we can appeal to DW for a current opinion on iron supplementation? 

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The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world’s problems. Mohandas Gandhi

John,I doubt if there is enough iron in chlorella to make any difference one way or the other, compared to the vast amounts of chelated iron I used to take when I was anaemic due to very heavy bleeding.

As for appealing to DW, I wouldn't dare at the moment, but we do both take about a dozen yaeyama chlorella tablets every evening and have done since before starting CAPi.  It works for us!.................Sarah

 

 

An Itinerary in Light and Shadow

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I am once again borderline anaemic and so tired - I am taking iron again - may never stop as I get in trouble over here!

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On Wheldon protocol for MSi since April, 2006.  doxyi 200 mgs daily, zithromax 250 mgs 3x/ week , Flagyli Pulses start end Sept., LDNi 2004. Gad-enhanced MRI of brain and spine shows NO NEW DISEASE ACTIVITY and one lesion diminishing in size on 9/30. Ma

I forgot to mention I take yaeyama chlorella tablets day and night and it hasn't boosted my iron level at all.

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On Wheldon protocol for MSi since April, 2006.  doxyi 200 mgs daily, zithromax 250 mgs 3x/ week , Flagyli Pulses start end Sept., LDNi 2004. Gad-enhanced MRI of brain and spine shows NO NEW DISEASE ACTIVITY and one lesion diminishing in size on 9/30. Ma

I had no idea that cpni uses iron. I always have low iron and after 3 + years of no red meat i actually bought some lamb yesterday because I kept craving hamburgers. Wierd, seems the cpn takes a sublte control, even tells me what It wants to eat. I felt so much better after the lamb burger...

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CPNi pcri and antibody positive , treating MSi, CFSi, TMJ, trigeminal neuralgia, IBSi neutropenia, pus found in facial bone, Doxyi 100x2,Doxy 200x2 zithro 250x1 alternate days. Metroi pulses each month.

About the time I was infected with the CPni, then double pneumonia; I was anemic.   So, I ate more red meat & took a supplement with iron & all was well.

 Then a few years ago my iron levels & storage levels were wonky.  It was later determined by a genetic specialist that I have genetic hemochromatosis.  My levels are watched quarterly & I take a heaping tsp. of yaeyama once daily for it's mopper ability.  My iron & storage are high but still not in "dangerous" zone when I would need a phlebotomy. 

NOooo, not a labotamy, though sometimes I feel like I have had one of those!

peace

r

 

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CFIDSi/ME 32 yrs, FMSi, IBSi, EBVi, CMV, Cpni, H1, chronic insomnia, Lymes, HME, Natural HRT peri-M, NAC 3 gm, Full CAP 6-2-08, all supplementsi +Sea Kelp, Chitosan Pulse 16 1-4-09 1gm Flagyli/day-3 days