MediTest
21 Apr 2019
Author
tuftyone
Title

Restarting abx

Body

hello if I was going to restart abx to take in conjunction with herbs, shall i begin the whole protocol again? 

Thanks

Comments

Tufty, you haven't not been taking them for that long, so just restart and then start pulsing again after three weeks.

I'm glad you are restarting!

Sarah

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

What did I miss?

The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world’s problems. Mohandas Gandhi

The herbs haven’t been making feel well and it doesn’t really feel like die-off as the ill feeling is quite quick to occur. Deciding to get a proper diagnostic test from a German lab before moving on and may have to combine abx with herbs if positive. 

Diagnosed RRMS 1999. No DMDs or other meds. Have done TMJ correction, Candida protocol, CCSVI venoplasty procedure.

Tufty, have you re-started the abx or are you waiting for that diagnostic test as well? Wait too long and you will find that you are no longer relapsing-remitting, like happened to me.

This site currently has a whole clutch of new people taking CAP antibiotics, two of whom are English and have just finished their second pulse, having bought the stuff from the same place as you, in India.

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

I’m really waiting to get the diagnostics. The gp previously agreed to take the bloods for me so have just written to him again.

I'm not too sure about those abx as they previously gave me terrible arithmia 

Diagnosed RRMS 1999. No DMDs or other meds. Have done TMJ correction, Candida protocol, CCSVI venoplasty procedure.

I’d be really interested in other people’s experience with the Indian abx 

Diagnosed RRMS 1999. No DMDs or other meds. Have done TMJ correction, Candida protocol, CCSVI venoplasty procedure.

Well Tufty

Living in India we have no option but to use Indian made antibiotics. But let me assure you Indian pharma industry is top notch!

Also ask Elizabeth Anne Lizzie, she has been using abx with meds sent from India and she is doing fine. She has reported improvements after second pulse.

 

By the way my daughter in law is on this abx regime but is only 20 days into it. So nothing to report as of now but she is doing well with no adverse reaction except puking one night, which could be due to something else she ate, even vitamins!.

Neena

 

I am 76 years old. My daughter-in-law was diagnosed with MS and we are all very keen for her to start this new antibiotic treatment. We hope to be able to do this in the next couple of weeks by finding a doctor willing to deal with any issues like reactions that may crop up. My daughter-in-law is 43 years old.

I have been an active poilitical journalist most of my life and have felt for a long time that there must be a cure out there for MS which the medical community has largely ignored. I am very excited by the Wheldon protocol.

Tufty, if you look at the small print of what on abx from English pharmacies, many of them come from India.

As for the arrythmia, did it happen with just one or did they both cause it?  You can't just not use something because it comes from India: you might have a sensitivity to one of the abx, but also it might just be caused by having a nervous disposition: I have been through such things myself.  The disease doesn't help!

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

Oh, solved the problem! I have only used roxithromycin so I didn't know that.

Tufty, order some tonight and get it sent by EDS and you can restart in about a week or 10 days, or if you have some doxy, start with that tomorrow then add roxi when you get it!  when I gave up on my GP and started buying it myself from Thailand or India, it often was a nice sky blue colour, made by Abbott, one of the biggest supplier of generic abx, now based in India.

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

I guess it could have been the azi causing problems and actually it was tachycardia more than arrhythmia. My heart rate went up to 170 at one point. 

I’ve found  someone to take my bloods now I so should get the lab test back in a week or so. I’ll wait to order the other ABX following a positive result. I simply can’t afford to waste any more money unnecessarily! Thanks for your comments 

Diagnosed RRMS 1999. No DMDs or other meds. Have done TMJ correction, Candida protocol, CCSVI venoplasty procedure.

That's just what I was going to say Bo! A man called Red, from California I think, got completely better with the treatment.

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

Yes I’ve read that too but I think it’s typically used in a lot lower dosage. I wonder if some of us detox through our skin, and in my case the skin on my nose!

Diagnosed RRMS 1999. No DMDs or other meds. Have done TMJ correction, Candida protocol, CCSVI venoplasty procedure.

Tufty, the typical 'lower dosage' used is not CAP, but just doxycycline, as used for excema. Red decided he would try CAP and hopefully get rid of it once and for all. It worked.

I can't put you in touch because this was years ago and he seems to have deactivated his account to get on with his life, , which is something I sometimes wish I had done! But I didn't, so now please listen to me! 

My MS first developed when I was in my mid twenties, but each relapse didn't last long and in the periods between relapses I thought that I was so unaffected, it wasn't so bad after all. 

However, by the turn of the century I was unable to walk even four miles.  Suddenly things all started getting worse as my MS became progressive. In 2002 I had a big commission from Cunard to work on, doing six big oil paintings for the new QM2 cruise ship.  Throughout this time, my intelligence took a nose dive: the sketches I did for the designs were fine, but each painting became successively more difficult.  I just about got them finished although it took me two weeks to sign them.  David had to go to London to buy me some non-toxic spray varnish, but he had to varnish them for me.

two weeks later I got my diagnosis of SPMS and  overheard Fat-Face saying to David that I was so bad that he should put me in a nursing home and get on with his life.

Well, David  did get on with his life, though not as Fat-Face meant. A few days of research in his laboratory and he brought me back my first pack of doxycycline.

Now, I don't know if your MS has turned progressive yet, but the longer you leave it, the more difficult it will get to pull out of it.  David was worried that it might be too late for me. but it wasn't.  It is only my walking that still leaves something to be desired.

So Tufty, please be brave!

 

 

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

As always, thanks or your encourage and enthusiasm Sarah, but  for me it’s not about being brave now. I've taken so many risks and made so many commitments to various treatments which have cost me a lot and just ended up actually making me a bit worse. I've had my jugular veins ballooned, I've done a three year orthodontic treatment and another three years of a strict Candida protocol. I've always tended to enthusiastically jump in feet first. 

I was reading Buhner's book again yesterday. He was writing about Porphyria. I've just followed his CPN protocol for over a month and throughout this time I felt like I was herxing and could barely stand at one point. Periods of die-off should typically last for a few weeks and he warns that any more than this could imply Porphyria and he even gives a link to your website, so I guess I really need to ensure that I don’t have this before proceeding with the CAP.

My plan now is to get the diagnostics done and then move forward from there.

Thanks again

 

Diagnosed RRMS 1999. No DMDs or other meds. Have done TMJ correction, Candida protocol, CCSVI venoplasty procedure.

Tufty,

just to share this with you. My daughter-in-law who started the protocol just 20 days ago had an alarming rash all over her face the other day, which fortunately cleared up within an hour. She thinks magnesium may not have agreed with her, afdded to her supplements recently. In any case, I told her to keep off magnesium for a couple of days and see and then reduce the magnesium dosage.

Was wondering whether you rash had also to be with some supplement or food rather than anti biotics. Just a thought.

Neena

I am 76 years old. My daughter-in-law was diagnosed with MS and we are all very keen for her to start this new antibiotic treatment. We hope to be able to do this in the next couple of weeks by finding a doctor willing to deal with any issues like reactions that may crop up. My daughter-in-law is 43 years old.

I have been an active poilitical journalist most of my life and have felt for a long time that there must be a cure out there for MS which the medical community has largely ignored. I am very excited by the Wheldon protocol.

I understand Tufty, and sometimes my enthusiasm gets the better of me. It's just a pity that you came to CAP after all the other, costly and unlikely to work stuff.

When you say 'your site,'  I presume you mean David's site and not mine!

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

Sarah - it is this site (cpnhelp.org) which is mentioned, in the Forword to Stephen Buhner’s ‘Healing Lyme’ book - foreword written by Neil Nathan MD.

Neuro symptoms & many health problems from 1989. NAC+all supps(04/11) CAP(05/11-10/17)

Good, because neither Stephen Buhner nor Neil Nathan appear in Quackwatch!

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

Tuftyone - you mention secondary porphyria. I had an horrendous time with secondary porphyria the whole time I was taking abx - six and a half years. I still have occasional flare-ups of porphyria now, which can be debilitating for a few days. It didn’t put me off treating though. Extra carbs/glucose always helped, plus extra detoxing such as liposomal glutathione and Alka Seltzer Gold (the US version).

Neuro symptoms & many health problems from 1989. NAC+all supps(04/11) CAP(05/11-10/17)

 Having thought about it, I think my recent reactions to the antibiotics and in particular doxycycline was caused by my intolerance to chemicals. They contain salicylates which I react to, the yellow dye in doxy for instance causes a lot of problems for people with chemical intolerances and often causes rapid heart rate and skin rashes.  The herbs I was also taking would have been full of sals and this may have caused my extreme immobility. Three weeks after stopping, I felt a lot better. 

 Looks like I’ll have some choices to make pending a positive diagnosis 

Diagnosed RRMS 1999. No DMDs or other meds. Have done TMJ correction, Candida protocol, CCSVI venoplasty procedure.

Tufty, doxycycline does not contain salicylates. Here is something from The British Society for Antimicrobial Chemotherapy, where salicylates were added to various antibiotics to see what the result would be.

https://academic.oup.com/jac/article-abstract/26/3/343/882961?redirectedFrom=fulltext

Abstract

Sodium salicylate was combined with the antibiotics amikacin, aztreonam, cefazolin, cefonicid, cefoperazone, ceftizoximc, norfloxacin, doxycycline, clindamycin, imipenem, mezlocillin and trimethoprim-sulphamethoxasole. The activity of the combinations was tested against encapsulated strains of Klebsiella pneumoniae, which differed markedly in their antibiotic susceptibility. The addition of salicylate (from 2 to 350 mg/l) to cultures increased the MIC of most antimicrobial agents from two- to four-fold, with the exception of imipenem and amikacin. Inhibition by imipenem was largely unchanged, and that of amikacin was increased in the presence of salicylate. The synergy of the combination of cefazolin and amikacin was abolished by salicylate, while the synergistic activity of imipenem and amikacin was significantly increased by salicylate. Doxycycline activity was most severely affected by salicylate as antimicrobial activity was significantly diminished at salicylate levels as low as 5 mg/l. In contrast, significant loss of inhibitory activity with other antimicrobials required at least 100 mg/l of salicylate. The clinical implications of salicylate on the sensitivity of K. pneumoniae to antimicrobials are discussed.

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

Also, the colour of doxycycline antibiotics is not due to a dye but is the colour of doxycycline itself.

Completed Stratton/Wheldon regime for aggressive secondary progressive MS in June 2007, after four years, three of which intermittent.   Still improving bit by bit and no relapses since finishing treatment.

Thanks sarah I think I’ve just become extremely sensitive to any chemicals and I could have been reacting to the abx itself. Many of my ‘sensitive’ friends have a big problem with taking pharmaceuticals. Bit of a nightmare really 🙂

Diagnosed RRMS 1999. No DMDs or other meds. Have done TMJ correction, Candida protocol, CCSVI venoplasty procedure.

Wow, this thread takes me back to when a bunch of us were starting this protocol, pretty much 'flying blind' back in 2006.

People, this isn't the two-week course of antibiotics that makes you progressively better every day. it's the several year long treatment that has ups and downs and sometimes they're pretty dramatic.

I'm packing for a trip, so I'll make this brief. You have rosacea? Well, when the antibiotics work on the cpn in that area, you're going to have a BATTLE going on. Abx are fighting cpn in that location. It's no cakewalk. The cpn is fighting hard for its very existence and that creates massive inflammation (and inflammation is the underlying issue with most of our so-called 'autoimmune' diseases). You have balance issues? Boy oh boy, are you going to have BIGGER balance issues, while the abx and the cpn battle it out.

The areas affected by cpn are going to feel worse, look worse, exhibit bigger symptoms, before it turns around. I'd be more worried if this DIDN'T happen. This is the strongest indicator that the antibiotics are, in fact, doing their job.

If you keep backing off in fear of the 'worsened symptoms;, the cpn will win. Accept the fact symptoms are going to flare up during treatment and plow through it.

The difference between what we do and what we are capable of doing would suffice to solve most of the world’s problems. Mohandas Gandhi